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Zonic
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Joined: 07 Jun 2005
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140.  Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Doesn't Ultramix 3 & 4 and the Universe games have a "story" mode? |
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mequetrefe413
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Joined: 20 Jul 2007
Location: Springfield, MA |
| 141. Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:53 pm Post subject: |
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Someone mentioned the "DanceMania" issue for licenses. It would be easier for the Konami of America to deal with the artists and the labels that represent them directly using the RIAA method for licensing. This can ease the use of what are "Dancemania" licenses in Japan (which has a very lax process for licensing, compared to USA, and the UK).
And did someone mentioned about the Hip Hop that is coming out these days? Most of it is total crap that would had not made it into radio 16-18 years ago where it had to be a great song to have airplay on radio, compared to the "legal payola" that forces crappy songs like "Crank That" and "Lollipop". There was more creativity on Hip Hop and R & B back then (where cursing was not as heavy, except for gangsta Rap) than today.
And I am going on the record on this: I'll be damned if "Crank That" makes it in a DDR game (for the PS2 or PS3) for the USA before "Dam Dariram" does (and we had been asking for this one for CENTURIES LOL) |
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koffan2
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Joined: 22 Sep 2004
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| 142. Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 12:27 am Post subject: |
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I miss Dancemania. What were the two DM songs in SN2? Me Against the Music, and....? I don't know the other one. I really wanted some DM songs in US home versions, too. I really want to play Flash in the Night just once.
Lollipop wasn't too bad, I guess. Not inspired, but catchy. Crank That was fun for a while, but it's over now. 90s music was generally better than music today. Rock wasn't crap, and rap and R&B were so much better. Music was more creative than gimmicky and catchy.
We did get Dam Dariram, except it was on UM2. A bit saddening, I messed up my XBox and I want to play some of the songs that were only on the UMs.
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mequetrefe413
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Joined: 20 Jul 2007
Location: Springfield, MA |
| 143. Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 7:45 am Post subject: |
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| Just to clear it out for some, it was directed for PS2 (or even PS3) releases for the USA, since Konami makes their Arcade titles for the Playstation systems. I am aware of "Dam Dariram" was on Ultramix 2 (but that game was made by a third party, and not directly by Konami, similar to DDR Disney Channel edition, and the plug-and-play DDR Disney Mix) |
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Pie~
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Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Location: California |
| 144. Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 9:40 am Post subject: |
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| koffan2 wrote: | | I miss Dancemania. What were the two DM songs in SN2? Me Against the Music, and....? |
Unbelievable.
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BAGGER VANCE
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Joined: 01 Aug 2007
Location: grand rapids, MI |
| 145. Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 9:51 am Post subject: |
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| mequetrefe413 wrote: | | Just to clear it out for some, it was directed for PS2 (or even PS3) releases for the USA, since Konami makes their Arcade titles for the Playstation systems. I am aware of "Dam Dariram" was on Ultramix 2 (but that game was made by a third party, and not directly by Konami, similar to DDR Disney Channel edition, and the plug-and-play DDR Disney Mix) |
the ultramix games we're indeed made by konami..... konami of hawaii. The normal games were made by konami of japan. Hence why the ultramix games were so much better when it came to things like trying new things(online play, not crappy battle modes, 4 player, quad mode, ect). What new things has the KOJ team tried over the years? exactly. |
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Zukin-Man
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Joined: 25 Nov 2002
Location: War Agony |
| 146. Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Zonic wrote: | | Doesn't Ultramix 3 & 4 and the Universe games have a "story" mode? |
Sort of. It was called Quest Mode, but it wasn't exactly a "Story Mode". You went around the country, city, or islands (depending on the game) and completed challenges, but there was really no real storyline to go with it.
The challenges were simple and didn't vary much, like getting a certain amount of modified DP in a song, a combo of consecutive steps, jumps, or freezes, or beating a CPU opponent. The only difference as you progressed through through Quest Mode was that the difficulty increased (more required DP, higher combos, or more resilient CPU).
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Sharpay Evans
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Joined: 11 Jul 2003
Location: I believe in dancin....shootin for the stars |
| 147. Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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| jpop'n floss wrote: | | mequetrefe413 wrote: | | Just to clear it out for some, it was directed for PS2 (or even PS3) releases for the USA, since Konami makes their Arcade titles for the Playstation systems. I am aware of "Dam Dariram" was on Ultramix 2 (but that game was made by a third party, and not directly by Konami, similar to DDR Disney Channel edition, and the plug-and-play DDR Disney Mix) |
the ultramix games we're indeed made by konami..... konami of hawaii. The normal games were made by konami of japan. Hence why the ultramix games were so much better when it came to things like trying new things(online play, not crappy battle modes, 4 player, quad mode, ect). What new things has the KOJ team tried over the years? exactly. |
Lol i agree with you on the features Ultramix introduced. To bad the overall games were just a mess and a waste of good songs IMO.
The same way i feel about Universe. |
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Knuckles1859
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Joined: 17 Dec 2005
Location: Pawtucket, Rhode Island |
| 148. Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 6:13 am Post subject: |
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I dont really see what the problem people have with the DDR universe series. It just seems like everytime I come on here someone is attacking the Xbox DDR games.
P.S I didnt write this to get anyone pissed off, im just alittle curious.
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LEEROOOOOY JENNNNNKINS
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Joined: 01 Nov 2007
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| 149. Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| Less than three on DDR? Fucking win. |
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Zukin-Man
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Joined: 25 Nov 2002
Location: War Agony |
| 150. Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:29 am Post subject: |
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| Knuckles1859 wrote: | | I dont really see what the problem people have with the DDR universe series. It just seems like everytime I come on here someone is attacking the Xbox DDR games. |
Most people I've talked to who hate the XBox series do so because the license:KO ratio favors licenses so much.
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LEEROOOOOY JENNNNNKINS
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Joined: 01 Nov 2007
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| 151. Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:35 am Post subject: |
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| Zukin-Man wrote: | | Knuckles1859 wrote: | | I dont really see what the problem people have with the DDR universe series. It just seems like everytime I come on here someone is attacking the Xbox DDR games. |
Most people I've talked to who hate the XBox series do so because the license:KO ratio favors licenses so much. |
Yeah defnitely- and on top of that the official Konami pads are so horrible to play on cuz they messed with the dimensions of the arrows. I spent $75 on DDR Universe 2 and returned it the next day just because the pad was so terrible. |
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Liquid Zero
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Joined: 11 Apr 2003
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| 152. Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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| mequetrefe413 wrote: |
And did someone mentioned about the Hip Hop that is coming out these days? Most of it is total crap that would had not made it into radio 16-18 years ago where it had to be a great song to have airplay on radio, compared to the "legal payola" that forces crappy songs like "Crank That" and "Lollipop". There was more creativity on Hip Hop and R & B back then (where cursing was not as heavy, except for gangsta Rap) than today.
And I am going on the record on this: I'll be damned if "Crank That" makes it in a DDR game (for the PS2 or PS3) for the USA before "Dam Dariram" does (and we had been asking for this one for CENTURIES LOL) |
I can agree with this, but I still feel like DDR can benefit from the hip-hop genre (Hip-hop is more about the rhythm than Rap is). Electronic-influenced music is always great, and they can keep their predominance of this, but I think regardless, DDR should embrace the diversity of music that gets people in a dancing mood more than they do now. We always have these ridiculously slow R&B songs, so I figure it's time we see more upbeat urban flavor (Visually, DDRX appears to embrace this route, but will it end there?).
IMO, there's no point for the less-inspired DDR releases (Arcade versions, PS2 ports, etc.) to remain so electronic-centric (even though that's one my favorite kind of music) when it's breaking itself into other regions with decisions like international arcade releases (again, I understand electronic influences is part of DDR's image, so I'm not dissing that, but rather the lack of embracing more diversity in the midst of such less-inspired DDR releases). I guess I'm just saying there's other music genres out there that also equally get people in a dancing mood (if not better) that deserve more presence in songlists...and can be approached and composed and presented with equal tastefulness without having to be saturated with electronic inspiration. And I think the hip-hop genre (among other genres I would also consider) is probably the biggest candidate in this situation. This is what I hope for DDR X, especially if it turns out being the next Arcade mix.
(and before I get hounded by all the idiots out there who think I'm asking for a bunch of lame mainstream licenses that do nothing but butcher the genres they are inspired from, no, I am not asking for that. But I am asking for more intelligent selection of such licenses or more KOs that are composed in such genres of music if they feel they can't find any good enough licenses)
I prefer 4-panel's natural approach over PIU's 5-panel. So, when I listen to PIU's songlists, I always wished, "why can't DDR have songlists be a little more diverse like this?"
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Zukin-Man
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Joined: 25 Nov 2002
Location: War Agony |
| 153. Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| LEEROOOOOY JENNNNNKINS wrote: | | Yeah defnitely- and on top of that the official Konami pads are so horrible to play on cuz they messed with the dimensions of the arrows. I spent $75 on DDR Universe 2 and returned it the next day just because the pad was so terrible. |
Of course the official pads suck. That's why you buy a decent third-party pad.
Personally, I use the MadCatz Beat Pad Pro. People talk a lot of shit about it, but it's one of the best soft pads I've used...Besides, I think it's the only third-party pad for the 360, so that doesn't leave much choice.
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zdemigoth
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Joined: 05 Oct 2002
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| 154. Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2008 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Liquid Zero wrote: | | I can agree with this, but I still feel like DDR can benefit from the hip-hop genre (Hip-hop is more about the rhythm than Rap is). Electronic-influenced music is always great, and they can keep their predominance of this, but I think regardless, DDR should embrace the diversity of music that gets people in a dancing mood more than they do now. We always have these ridiculously slow R&B songs, so I figure it's time we see more upbeat urban flavor (Visually, DDRX appears to embrace this route, but will it end there?). |
Even if the song itself is slow, Konami could actually make stepcharts that use (God-forbid) 16th notes. Secret Rendezvous is a perfect example of how to take a slow R&B-style song and give it an interesting chart, as opposed to something like Every Day, Every Night which could have also used more 16ths like it did at the end.
Unless they are actually paying attention, Konami is taking DDR down a road towards mass-market appeal instead of catering to the solid fanbase. We will continue to see sub-par repetitive charts for licenses hear on Top 20 radio and such. And I am sure there are some that think the stepcharts for DDR are still decent, but compare a chart rated 7 from SN2 to one from 3rd, 4th, or solo mix and tell me that they are better now. |
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Catastrophe
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Joined: 04 Mar 2002
Location: Worcester, MA |
| 155. Posted: Sun Jun 22, 2008 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | And I am sure there are some that think the stepcharts for DDR are still decent, but compare a chart rated 7 from SN2 to one from 3rd, 4th, or solo mix and tell me that they are better now. |
I think the sevens are of the same quality they've always been. And you're being arbitrary. Are the fives any worse or any better? No, of course not, because they're fives! There isn't enough "going on" in a five rate it. You can make Forever Sunshine, or you can make Drop the Bomb without the ending. Either way it's a walking pace. Sevens are the minimum threshold of interesting. That's where I think DDR becomes fun. Below 7s you're burning calories and having fun listening to the music. But the charts aren't addicting.
So sevens are the beginning are the beginning of "oh hey I like DDR for a new reason now." Hopefully every player gets there even if they don't want to clear any 8s. But sevens are still kind a jog that just begins to interact with the music. Da Capo is perfect, but also not praise worthy. If I had to compare it to The Race, there's no contest. The winner is whichever song you like more. The 8s and 9s of 1999-2001 were pretty awesome though. But then again, the licensees were better, and there were fewer songs, which allowed each individual song to shine more.
But there is something wrong with sevens today - the false sevens. We had two songs in the last DDR game with a max combo of 199 rated as 7. No. Under the Sky? Konami seems to have a quota of sevens, which is a good thing. But lately they've been filling the quota with non-sevens. Sunkiss Drop has 9 fewer steps than Exotic Ethnic and rips off the chart exactly, right down to the jumps in the middle. I guess that makes it a crappy seven, but a good nine. |
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Nightime
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Joined: 28 Jan 2002
Location: anywhere else |
| 156. Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2008 7:22 am Post subject: |
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IIRC, Under the Sky was originally rated as a SIX. X'O And then obviously booed, because the long running section at the end was nearly eightworthy, whereas the rest of the stepchart was about like a sleepthrough four. ~.~' All in all, mixing an easy 2/3 of a song with an obviously mismatched ending is just a bad idea... and they *could* always rechart the song (or at *least* squeeze in more freeze-step or skipping action to it).
As for SUNKISS <3 DROP vs. exotic ethnic, there's a very obvious difference in stepchart complexity and tempo/pacing. S<3D is something I might rate as an 8 tops, due to the crossover steps involved - not exactly the first thing I got used to while playing Maniac/Heavy/Expert/SSR. Again, those of us going on 5 or more years now are pretty much taking for granted patterns that we can just whiff out, because we've been there so for long. It's still a considerable learning step, though, for those still getting into the swing of it.
THE RACE, btw, is not another stage I wouldn't rate a 7 either! It has way too much jump-streaming in it. (And don't get me started on UPSIDE DOWN... though it would be cool to play those two again!) |
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Pie~
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Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Location: California |
| 157. Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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Under the Sky IS a six. I'm not sure where you guys are getting the idea that it's rated a 7.
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koffan2
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Joined: 22 Sep 2004
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| 158. Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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7-footers are more over-the-place in terms of difficulty nowadays. SUNKISS DROP and Raspberry Heart seem very different, yet they have the same rating. There's more examples, but those two stand out to me.
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Blind Justice, Bloody Tears, Freedom, Pluto, Poseidon, and Pink Rose for DDR X CS! 1 down, 5 to go. |
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zdemigoth
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Joined: 05 Oct 2002
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| 159. Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Nightime wrote: | | THE RACE, btw, is not another stage I wouldn't rate a 7 either! It has way too much jump-streaming in it. (And don't get me started on UPSIDE DOWN... though it would be cool to play those two again!) |
But that is my exact point, the ratings back in the day were much better. A six like Drop the Bomb was actually interesting, sevens like Operator and The Race (and Upside Down) actually had replay value, and the general difficulty was higher.
DDR has take the opposite route of IIDX: it gets dumbed down with each subsequent release. The charts get a bit easier overall (with some noticeable exceptions that are usually way too difficult to be fun), the quality of the licenses is just a bit worse (R&P, Stay, Ghosts --> Modern Girl, Doesn't Really Matter, Angelus), and the KOs seem to get a bit weaker (Drop the Bomb --> Flow, Dive --> Peace, B4U --> My Only Shining Star). They really should get the IIDX music team to pop out some new KOs or revisit the large albums of cross-overs they haven't used, ditch the J-Pop licenses and either go back to old Dancemania albums or find more mainstream dance tracks, and stop download simfiles for stepchart inspiration. |
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