My home built metal DDR pad (Part IV)

[Flound3r]

Which design has better sensitivity?
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Wow my sig got messed up.

[riptide]

Since we're on the subject of sensor design, I thought I would post two things...

First, I'm working on a new sensor design for my pad design. It will be a bit closer to the way the arcade pads work. -- no mending brackets, no sheet metal glued to the underside of the panels, and hopefully a much softer sound. I have created a prototype sensor, and it works, but I have yet to test it in the pad. I plan on building out a full test this weekend, but I do not have a playstation2 to run ddr. I will try and dig up my ps2->usb converter and run stepmania on my puter... if that fails, I'll break down and buy a used ps2 for cheap.

There are a few bonuses to the new design... the cost of the new materials versus the cost of the materials being replaced is much cheaper... mending brackets are expensive. The materials being used are plastic sheets, tin/aluminum foil, ~14 gauge wire(maybe), hard foam blocks (craft section of walmart), mounting tape, and the sheet metal that would have been glued to the bottom of the arrow panels (I'm ripping mine off and re-using them). There may be a few more or less things depending on how the final design is set up. I don't want to give too much more info before I know how well it works. I also need to stress test it, and I suck at DDR now (haven't played in probably 2 years).

Second, I have redesigned my page. I found out I was linked to from Wikipedia, so I decided to make things a bit nicer looking. I removed the comments and link to my forums because I am usually too busy to check them. So emails to me or posts here get better/quicker answers usually.
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- RipTide
riptide (at) digitaltorque (dot) com

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My pad design: http://www.wubros.com/ddrpad/

[circusfreak]

[quote="Flound3r"]Which design has better sensitivity?[/quote]

I think based on a ton of reading and building 4 pads that Matrix's sensor design is the best and easiest so far. Search back a ways and look for it, but basically, its 2 mending brackets with a couple small pieces of mousepad in between, and held together during construction with tape.

I just finished building a pair of pads for my neighbors family and used Matrix sensors on both. The best thing about this design is that you don't have to connect anything to the underside of the step. That was the most time consuming part of my first attempt at a pad. Also, the mouse pad is way more resilient than the weather stripping and should last a long time.

I used 2 layers of 1/4" plexi for the steps, and even then they still flex when a full sized adult plays, and creates a fairly noticable creak/squeak sound. To get rid of this and make it more solid, I took a cue from Gecko's pad, but instead of placing a block in the center, I just added a 5th sensor in the middle set slightly below the other by like 1/16". This removes the flex, makes the step more solid, and also nicely adds yet more sensitivity to the step. They feel perfect now.

One more thing to note. Matrix's pics show the sensor being held together with scotch tape to hold it in place. I found that after a little while the tape breaks down, so when you take a step off, the sensors do not stay together. I replaced with electrical tape and now its golden.

[riptide]

Circusfreak, I think you might have mistaken someone else's sensor design for mine... I don't remember ever creating a design that uses mouse pads or scotch tape, but it does sound like an interesting design.

My current design does use mending brackets, but they're not sandwiching mousepad.
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- RipTide
riptide (at) digitaltorque (dot) com

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My pad design: http://www.wubros.com/ddrpad/

[circusfreak]

[quote="riptide"]Circusfreak, I think you might have mistaken someone else's sensor design for mine... I don't remember ever creating a design that uses mouse pads or scotch tape, but it does sound like an interesting design.

My current design does use mending brackets, but they're not sandwiching mousepad.[/quote]


SORRY! I had a brain fart and I meant to say the MATRIX sensors. His design is the sandwich of mousepad between mending brax. But am looking forward to seeing if your new design works out as well, Rip!

I have edited the original post...

[riptide]

no problem... just didn't want to steal anyone's thunder
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- RipTide
riptide (at) digitaltorque (dot) com

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My pad design: http://www.wubros.com/ddrpad/

[riptide]

So, I have decided that I am going to compile Home made DDR Pad information to send in to a DDR Freak contributor so we can have a lot of this info posted under the FAQ section here at DDR Freak.

I'm going to be browsing through the forums gathering info to use... the basic idea is to compile a basic description of the general categories of pad designs and their modifications with links to go along with the info... this way hopefully the page/info/howto itself can be kept fairly small with links to the major info being the sites various people like DDRHomePad and myself have put up. In essence, it'll be a digest containing references and links to allow quick access to all of the meat.

There is a LOT of info in the hundreds of pages here, so if you know of something you definitely want to be included, please email me at [email protected] and I will work it in. (I have a filter on my mail server... anything with ddr or dance pad in the subject line gets put in a folder, so it would be great if you could do that).

Thanks guys... hopefully a page on ddr freak will help the different ddr pad designs get better recognition and visibility... maybe even better search engine rankings for the various sites dedicated toward the designs.

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I currently have information for: DDRHomePad's design, my design, Stoli's design, Matrix's sensor design, and Marcan's pad lighting schematics.

I know Shadow_Dragonz's FAQ is posted on the forums here, but is there also a site or page that contains it?

I am also looking for working links to the various arrow panel graphics. If there is no working link, send me the graphic and I will create a page to host them on my server.
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- RipTide
riptide (at) digitaltorque (dot) com

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My pad design: http://www.wubros.com/ddrpad/

[traydemark03]

Hey riptide, you should look at Matrix's contact design. Circusfreak pretty much summed it up and it works perfectly. I used superglue instead of tape.

After having the most difficult problem cutting those little wooden triangle pieces under corner braces for my first pad, I've been thinking of using heavy duty velcro instead for the second one.

And I found if you iron the sides of the plexi, they pretty much melt enough to stick together.

So pretty much, I would use matrix's sensors and then put velcro on top of those to keep the panels down and in place. I would also mount t brackets on the sides of the pad to keep the panel in just in case.

The velcro allows you to still be able to perform maintenance on the pad but durable enough to keep the pad in place. Hopefully it'll dampen the sound of the sensors too.

Anyone have any thoughts or comments?

[riptide]

What part of the plexi are you ironing to get what to stick together? The two plexi pieces or the plexi and the velcro?

What are the T brackets for you mention?

Sorry, it's early in the morning for me, and I don't think I'm reading the post correctly, lol.
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- RipTide
riptide (at) digitaltorque (dot) com

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My pad design: http://www.wubros.com/ddrpad/

[traydemark03]

The sides of the plexi. So that both layers of the plexi stick together. This keeps the graphic from falling out and allows both of the layers of plexi to be a solid unit.

The back of the velcro is adhesive. I don't know how well it sticks on metal or plexi though. The image on the box shows that it can hold hammers and saws so I would think it would be durable enough to hold the panels on the base. Gravity also helps.

The T brackets are like mending brackets but in the shape of a t. I would mount them to the sides of the pad so that in any case the velcro isn't strong enough to hold them in position the top/horizontal part of the bracket would hold the arrow panels from slipping off the sides of the base .

So pretty much, the velcro takes the place of the corner brackets and the triangle pieces such that if the base were on its side or even upside down, the arrow panels would stay in place.

Oh yeah, it seems that galv sheet metal rusts easily (mine does anyway). Anyone know anything that would help keep the rust off?

[riptide]

Well, you'll first need to remove the rust. A polisher/buffer will probably work (or something that does the same thing).

From there, try wiping WD-40 on it. It contains rust preventative chemicals that adhere to the surface and supposedly keep rust away (may need to wipe from time to time).
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- RipTide
riptide (at) digitaltorque (dot) com

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My pad design: http://www.wubros.com/ddrpad/

[circusfreak]

I don't know if it will work well to iron the plexis together. In a riptide style pad, they will still flex quite a bit, and they will flex in different arcs since one is on top of the other, so I think the bond on the edge will probably break.

I have been using some electrical tape on the sides of the plexis to keep them together and the graphic inside. Also, a little spray adhesive on the graphic will keep it in place nice just like a sticker. That will also keep it looking nicer longer since it wont slide at all.

[quote="traydemark03"]The sides of the plexi. So that both layers of the plexi stick together. This keeps the graphic from falling out and allows both of the layers of plexi to be a solid unit.

The back of the velcro is adhesive. I don't know how well it sticks on metal or plexi though. The image on the box shows that it can hold hammers and saws so I would think it would be durable enough to hold the panels on the base. Gravity also helps.

The T brackets are like mending brackets but in the shape of a t. I would mount them to the sides of the pad so that in any case the velcro isn't strong enough to hold them in position the top/horizontal part of the bracket would hold the arrow panels from slipping off the sides of the base .

So pretty much, the velcro takes the place of the corner brackets and the triangle pieces such that if the base were on its side or even upside down, the arrow panels would stay in place.

Oh yeah, it seems that galv sheet metal rusts easily (mine does anyway). Anyone know anything that would help keep the rust off?[/quote]

[Weston]

I'm using something called MAAS. Says it's supposed to restore and protect all metals. So far, it gives a wonderful finish.

[devout]

I've used velcro on plexiglass for non-ddr projects, and it sticks fine... but it's important that you dont touch the sticky stuff with your fingers after you peel the backing off, and, once you stick it onto the plexi: press it very firmly, dont try to reposition it, and let it sit for a few hours before you put any kind of load on it. (Dont immediately see if it will hang upside down)

Incidently i've also tried melting the edges together, and while it does work, it might give you an ugly result. I melted just the corners together, and hid them under the corner bracket, which kind of defeats the purpose of what you're trying to do. In theory if both pieces are the same thickness and there is no slipping between them, the bond won't break. With two .25" pieces I dont think the flexing will be enough to make it a problem. I did it with two .125" pieces, which presumably flex a lot more, and it never broke.


I'm not sure if an iron will get hot enough to melt it... I used a soldering iron (or was that the iron you were talking about...). Since this just melts at a small point it's hard to get an even melt along the whole edge, hence the ugly result. If the iron is hot enough, maybe you'll do better.

[Weston]

Melting the edges together isn't something I'd though of when trying to keep the plastic together. I laminated my arrow paper then used double stick tape around the edges.

UPDATE: I've been busy with school and work lately so I haven't got much time to work on my new pad design, but for now, I'll leave you guys with a teaser of what's to come in the near future: Hope this builds anticipation! (Panels not yet attached with screws)

[ChilliumBromide]

I've finished and refinished and refinished again the DT600 blueprints now; I'll try to get my scanner working soon and get them scanned. If I don't find the driver for my scanner within 2 weeks, I'll have a friend scan the blue prints.

Also, I'm FINALLY starting on the DT600 prototypes; I'll try to remember to keep my camera with me while making it so I can take pics of the building process.
I'll have about 5 hours to work on them tomorrow.
AKA I'll have the base finished tomorrow, leaving me with just the panels, sensors, or plating.
Which may take a while. I'll probably just toss some of my tx1000 panels on and make a video of me stomping on it, then I'll buy some lexan panels.

Also, I'm applying for a job at Safeway, so that should a) lower prices and b) give me more money to buy materials with. =)
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I used to be active here lol

[Crimson7]

What can I use as a good substitute for corner brackets? I can't seem to find them anywhere and when I ask around the hardware stores, plus the people there don't even know anything about what they're selling.

I know about stoli's design but I would like something in the corners, not just simple squares.
I couldn't see statikeffeck's pad because the link I found is no more.
If anyone has some pics of substitutes for the corner brackets, can you post them, please? This would really help.

[traydemark03]

[Crimson7]

[devout]

If you have a picture of the brackets you could probably get them custom made by a local metal shop... they just need to be cut out of a sheet and bent in two places, so they shouldnt charge much.

(If you did want to get your own fabricated, you can get a dimensioned drawing from the website below... search for the item number then click "technical drawing" in the left frame)

You could also order them online... you can get them from www.mcmaster.com for US$1.19 each. (Item 1088A21) Unfortunately they dont tell you how much shipping is until after they charge you, so you might want to call them to make sure the international shipping charge isnt ridiculous.

If you can find some sort of thin metal or plastic box, you could also cut the corners off with a dremel and make your own that way. Thats a lot of work just for some corners though.