The OFFICIAL DDR and ItG Thread! No Flaming!

[Arctic Wolves]

When I first saw how disfigured ItG songs were on the Stepmania Groove Radar, I was pretty shocked. A lot of it is justified, but I feel the need to revive a point from a few posts ago about overabundant use of freeze arrows. I feel this is a cheap way to artificially pump difficulty; there's often nothing different about the way you have to step, but they just get... messy. It's exactly the kind of "aesthetic complaints" I was voicing earlier; this freeze madness looks terrible. I love the song Oasis, and it's steps aren't bad... with freezes off. There's no hands, and they really don't do anything except force a few turns. Even the funky facing away from the screen parts would still be there without the freezes (though double stepping would also now be possible). Oasis reads as having 2 hands; this is untrue, it's all do-able with the feet, it's just sloppy freeze placement that leads to this. Freezes are used for pathetic results in DDR, but used for MAX. (period) levels of artificial difficulty in ItG. I think it needs to be accepted that some songs just do NOT have the potential to be 10's, and jacking them with freezes doesn't change this. Although Queen of Light Expert is strangely fun, but that's because there's only a few runs of freezes, and the rest are actual hands.

Heh, it's kind of funny; Turning the Freeze modifier (or whatever the one is that makes a hell of a lot of freezes appear) wouldn't do much on some songs. A lot of the Expert charts that are 9's are excellent in ItG. I imagine this is because they're not trying to be overly difficult. Even with hands and freezes and mines they manage to be mostly enjoyable. The mines are lined up nicely, the hands are logical, the steps make sense! And they're fun! Mostly. =P
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[J. S. Mill]

I've posted this before but I'll post it again.

In order for a game to be fun to me there needs to be a challenge. I need to feel like I am improving and that there are things to do.

DDR has EXACTLY the following three type's of songs:

1) Way too easy - basically almost everything in the game. If I haven't AAAed it, I could easily. And I've AAAed almost everything here.
2) Wrong - Burning Heat, Gradiusic, Orion Civ etc. These songs aren't hard, the step syncer is just so wildly incompetent that they become difficult.
3) Fast - The ten footers except Bag.

-I have no motivation whatsoever to play (1) - I've AAAed everything.
-I have no motivation to play (2) - I could improve but I'd rather spend my time not going OH DARNIT ARGH I STEPPED ON THE ARROW AT THE RIGHT TIME WHY GOD WHY! IF ONLY I COULD BE WORSE AT UNDERSTANDING MUSIC!
-I have motivation to play (3) - but with just seven songs all of which I've had a long time to play it gets old.

In the Groove has songs which are:

1) Way too easy - no motivation to play
2) Wrong - much fewer of these, Fly With Me comes to mind...no motivation to play
3) Technically hard - Oasis etc - motivation to play
4) Special hard - hands and junk - motivation to play
5) Fast stuff - Pandemonium, VerTex etc - motivation to play.

That's just it, ITG has more songs that are interesting to play and there is more to do. Hence why I prefer the game
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[=^o.o^=]

I found a lot of ITG's double steps to be quite unnatural. Yes this problem has be brought up before, but it's just one of my biggest problems with ITG.

Besides from that and the lacking sized soundtrack (yes I know DDR started out with much less, but I'm looking at it from a practical view), it's a well put together game.

I really don't mind the quality of the patterns so much. I think they're well done for what they are at this time.

Being this is the first mix, I'm sure there will be much improvement. Remember this was the first mix that Roxor's team put together, so they need to learn everything that Konami learned (though they will benifit from Konomi's mistakes faster).

Right now I like DDR Extreme more, but ITG is close, and for the 'Extreme' of the DDR series to be challenged by another company's first mix, I think that's a great sign for the ITG future.

[J. S. Mill]

*this is Caffy at Kiba's house*

It is a well known fact that the vast majority of ITG1's doubles steps on expert are pretty crappy, this is a dead horse that has been beaten several times Not many people actually bother with doubles right now, although ITG2 is looking like a step in the right direction stepfile wise.
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[Dracosavant]

[Cheez]

[LET ME SHOW YOU THEM]

Not every step chart is going to be perfect to every person. I'll totally admit that i spend more time trying not to take a nap then actually FAing when playing Walking on Fire Expert at the very start, but considering that they had a grand total of about 5 or 6 people make steps for 71 different songs on ITG1, they're bound to have a couple of charts that aren't top notch. DDR sure as hell as some charts that aren't even close to top notch. The challenge that the RoXoR team is presented with is making a bunch of step charts to cover all ranges of difficulties in a short amount of time, with only a few people to do it. They *probably* don't have the operating capital to host a big national stepchart making contest with prizes and offering pay to have people make stepcharts. I'd wait to pass judgement on ITG2's steps until you've played them in the arcade. I remember the first dwi of Kiss Me Red and it was a mix of the hard and expert steps and i thought it was the most terrible thing ever. Then I actually played the steps on the arcade, and they weren't half bad. I could take the mp3 for sweet world and write steps in about 10 minutes, but that doesn't mean they're going to be good. We've all seen what comes out of tournamixes..that is why RoXoR has beta testing. Personally, for syncing issues, Seattle *isn't* the best place to beta for syncing because alot of people up there are visual players (northwest visual bar play ) and syncing issues don't affect visual players that much unless it is extremely off. Once 2 comes out, I'll definitely have an even stronger opinion of the steps they're making. Sorry if i rambled..22 hours of being awake makes me silly sometimes 8)
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theficionado wrote:

Seriously, they should make some sort of spray for you.

[Syncopation]

[J. S. Mill]

So you enjoy the following experience:

You are playing Burning Heat and you get a great so you shout:

DARNIT ALL! WHY DO I UNDERSTAND MUSIC! IF ONLY I WAS MORE DEAF! MAYBE IF PLAY FOR ANOTHER THREE MONTHS I CAN ADJUST TO A COMPLETELY MEANINGLESS AND INCOMPETENT WINDOW WHICH ONLY EXISTS BECAUSE THE CREATOR KNOWS NOTHING ABOUT MUSIC OR BECAUSE THERE WAS A PROGRAMMING ERROR!

IF ONLY I HAD LESS RYTHM AND UNDERSTOOD MUSIC LESS!!

Because when you're nitpicking between low sdg's on offsync songs, that's exactly what it feels like.
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[Karl Popper]

[ninjafetus]

I don't have much to add to this conversation except to say that Tears is probably one of the 5 best stepcharts ever made, imo.

Ummm... I like ITG a lot, though! And DDR! Love for everything is the way to go

...no, really, though, I'd say things, but they've been said.

EDIT: Oh my god, I can't believe I didn't notice anyone posting anything about marathons. Like ITG or hate it, you have to admit that marathons are the most interesting, most "new" thing that ITG has. I think they're the best part of the game.
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Drunk Slugs.

[PKMN.YnoT]

[J. S. Mill]

I've passed everything but Pandemonium and I still can't pass Energy normal.
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[Houou Don't You Want Me]

Are the Doubles charts really *that* bad? I didn't have much motivation to get ITG for PS2 after playing Stepmania to hell and back and I kinda convinced myself I will enjoy the Doubles charts... but if they are indeed that bad, I don't know if I'll get ITGPS2. I mean, saying I didn't like Emerzian's stepcharts is quite the understatement after seeing stuff like Boogie Down and Driving Force Classical. And don't tell me "they dont have interesting rhythms", that's bs. Absolutely NO song will force the stepchart maker to turn it into a straight 8th note run throughout the entire song.

[nekura]

[J. S. Mill]

[Phil Hellmuth]

Doubles stepcharts are just fine. People complain cuz they are difficult

ok maybe one ill complain is Hip Hop Jam EXPERT. WTF IS UP WITH THE FINAL!!!
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I can dodge bullets

[Rancidfish]

[ninjafetus]

[Disconnected airSpirit]

ITG Double is horrible in general...however...Bubble Dancer Hard and Bend Your Mind Expert.

(even if I can't pass BYM, it's still fun. and BD is fun for the mines - I'm a mine whore. )