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Ryu_Hirakashi
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Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Location: Middle River, MD |
0.  Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:44 pm Post subject: Only DDR??? |
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Well, let me start of by saying that DDR in itself is a great introductory game for the bemani series. Heck, I've played DDR for 3 years myself. But there is one burning question on my mind.
Why isn't the other bemani games getting any attention besides DDR. I mean I don't have any problem people loving DDR, but since I found out about the rest of the series I found it wierd that Konami isn't doing anything to bring any of the other bemani games to america.(run-on sentence :/)
I've found the bemani series to be quite revolutionary in it's premise to bring people closer to music, but people everywhere should have a chance to experience this masterful series. I'd actually kill to be able to go the arcade to to play IIDX,popn', or keyboard mania.
THERE'S MORE THAN DDR!!! Learn and you will become enlightened!!
There has to be some other reason besides lisencing(sp?) fees for songs. Why put so much effort into only DDR. What I'm saying might sound like incoherrent babbling, but I'm sure people get at what I'm saying. I'd like to get everyone's input.
Hirakashi Ryu
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| Quote: | | For a beginner, if learning how to play pop'n music is like a parent holding his / her child's hand while crossing a busty street, then learning to play IIDX is like being kicked out of a moving car in the middle of nowhere and having to scrape enough money for a taxi cab ride home. |
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tempest6
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Joined: 27 Jan 2002
Location: Glendale, CA, USA |
| 1. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:57 pm Post subject: Why the other Bemani Games?... |
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Because the other games like Para Para Paradise, Keyboardmania, and other games are not getting as popular like it used to be. With the exception of Beatmania IIDX Red, Guitar Freaks, DrumMania & Pop 'N Music. Is that a trip or what? Please reply, over! Thanks!
tempest6 |
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eryk
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Joined: 25 Jul 2003
Location: Toronto |
| 2. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Because DDR is more appealing for regular arcaders/tourists exc. to watch. And DDR is pretty much non-existant here... |
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Ryu_Hirakashi
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Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Location: Middle River, MD |
| 3. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 1:06 pm Post subject: |
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| ericz wrote: | | Because DDR is more appealing for regular arcaders/tourists exc. to watch. And DDR is pretty much non-existant here... |
and watching someone play any song on another or seeing a song on EX isn't. I live to see expert players when I'm at the arcade. They are what embodies video gaming. To reach that higher level of skill so that one can express him/herself in the ultimate of ways. To become formless and everchanging.
Hirakashi Ryu
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| Quote: | | For a beginner, if learning how to play pop'n music is like a parent holding his / her child's hand while crossing a busty street, then learning to play IIDX is like being kicked out of a moving car in the middle of nowhere and having to scrape enough money for a taxi cab ride home. |
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rampage
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Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Location: Redmond, WA |
| 4. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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As popular as DDR may be, it's still very much a niche market. While there are other popular music games out there such as Taiko Drum Master and Donkey Konga, there's just not enough profit margin to really justify bringing other series to America. They tried with Guitar Freaks, they tried with Beatmania, and they were all dismal failures. I honestly can't see games like Pop'n Music and IIDX gaining much ground in America.
While this discussion probably belongs in Other Bemani, I'm going to let it slide for now. |
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goodtimesddr
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Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Location: Temporary secret IIDX lair in Providence. |
| 5. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 2:52 pm Post subject: |
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To say the least.
Only the hardcore and devoted Bemani players ever heard of Beatmania or Drummania.
The general public are simply not interested in anything else but the dancing in Konami music games.
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I took the path least taken. Now where the hell am I? |
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eryk
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Joined: 25 Jul 2003
Location: Toronto |
| 6. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Not to mention there is barely any Bemani machines (that I know of) in North America. There is ONE fucking IIDX machine in ALL OF ONTARIO. |
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Ryu_Hirakashi
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Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Location: Middle River, MD |
| 7. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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| goodtimesddr wrote: | To say the least.
Only the hardcore and devoted Bemani players ever heard of Beatmania or Drummania.
The general public are simply not interested in anything else but the dancing in Konami music games. |
That's sad to hear. But IMHO it makes me tend to think that american gamers don't have a high standard for gaming. Considering what's popular in this country now, but I digress; they can play whatever they want. It's just sad that people here don't get to experience a higher quality bemani game.
Once DDR is gone there will be nothing left. It's not like Roxxor games is mass producing ITG anytime soon.
Maybe this market and the fighting game market suffer from the same ailiment. We're just too hardcore for are own good. But I'm not complaining about that one bit.
Hirakashi Ryu
p.s. Thanks Rampage for letting this thread slide. I wasn't really sure what forum this thread should have gone in.
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| Quote: | | For a beginner, if learning how to play pop'n music is like a parent holding his / her child's hand while crossing a busty street, then learning to play IIDX is like being kicked out of a moving car in the middle of nowhere and having to scrape enough money for a taxi cab ride home. |
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Capriccio
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Joined: 03 Mar 2004
Location: Chandler |
| 8. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | That's sad to hear. But IMHO it makes me tend to think that american gamers don't have a high standard for gaming. Considering what's popular in this country now, but I digress; they can play whatever they want. It's just sad that people here don't get to experience a higher quality bemani game.
Once DDR is gone there will be nothing left. It's not like Roxxor games is mass producing ITG anytime soon.
Maybe this market and the fighting game market suffer from the same ailiment. We're just too hardcore for are own good. But I'm not complaining about that one bit.
Hirakashi Ryu |
I imagine one of the main reasons that DDR is by far the most popular of its other, lesser-known Bemani cousins is because it is easy to pick up. Unlike a game such as IIDX, DDR does not require a massive amount of time to get relatively good at it. The same goes for GF&DM. DDR is simply innovative and appeals to a lot of people when they first see it, because it looks like loads of fun. If some random person with no knowledge of what IIDX was walked by someone playing a difficult song on IIDX, they probably wouldn't understand what the player was doing, but anyone can walk by someone playing DDR and say, "hey, that looks pretty fun, I think I'll try."
I wouldn't call DDR a "low quality" Bemani game. It's just one of the easiest.
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TheKatsurame
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Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Location: New York |
| 9. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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Here's why other Bemani won't make it in america:
Sure, there are the hardcore freaks like you and me that'll play anygame with buttons and music, but most people just don't get it. They get used to the 4 arrows. Hell, I can barely play PIU, cuz the 5 arrows in different spots absolutely drive me bonkers. DDR is the grand-pappy of music games, and people like it. Why would Konami risk replacing DDR with IIDX? Just not good business sense. Sure, IIDX is fun, but really, other than people who actually play DDR already, who else does? I'm a big fan of music games, and bemani, but the average person is gonna say, "Hmm...it's got 7 keys....too confusing, is this some kinda psycodelic fighting game?". They dont' see it as Bemani , they see it as a totally different game. They won't associate it with DDR and give it a try. Again, players like you and me will still play IIDX, but how many of us are there? Compare the demographics. We lose. |
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Slowpoke
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Joined: 28 Oct 2003
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| 10. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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It's all about the difficulty factor. Anyone who can tap their foot to a beat can get up on a DDR pad and pass their 3 beginner songs, but Beatmania is much harder to pick up.
Also, consider the typical reactions of people when they see these games for the first time. DDR: "Hey, I can dance... this could be fun". Beatmania: "Kinda looks like playing a musical instrument. I used to hate it when my mom forced me to take piano lessons. Screw this" |
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Mark
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Joined: 03 Jun 2002
Location: San Diego, CA |
| 11. Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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I believe DDR is the main Bemani game in America because it's easiest to bootleg, just a thought.
But as it is right now, DDR is quite outdated and more and more arcades are upgrading to ITG. If Konami doesn't release another DDR mix by late '05 or early '06, then I do believe ITG will take over the dancing simulator scene. |
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Ryu_Hirakashi
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Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Location: Middle River, MD |
| 12. Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 12:41 am Post subject: |
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Well from my experiences with IIDX it was never meant to be "fun". It's never been a word I would use to describe IIDX. Hence, why I could understand why you're average american gamer couldn't pick it up. People need to let go of that concept and they'll be a lot better off in the end when it comes to video gaming now-a-days.
Hirakashi Ryu
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| Quote: | | For a beginner, if learning how to play pop'n music is like a parent holding his / her child's hand while crossing a busty street, then learning to play IIDX is like being kicked out of a moving car in the middle of nowhere and having to scrape enough money for a taxi cab ride home. |
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Slowpoke
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Joined: 28 Oct 2003
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| 13. Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 11:24 am Post subject: |
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| Ryu_Hirakashi wrote: | Well from my experiences with IIDX it was never meant to be "fun". It's never been a word I would use to describe IIDX. Hence, why I could understand why you're average american gamer couldn't pick it up. People need to let go of that concept and they'll be a lot better off in the end when it comes to video gaming now-a-days.
Hirakashi Ryu |
... except 99% of the people out there play games because they want to have fun. That's pretty much why "games" were invented 20,000 years ago (or so)
Even if you divorce Beatmania from the "fun" aspect and merely look at it as a skill you wish to excel at, I'm not sure why someone would want to devote time to perfecting something they don't enjoy doing in the first place. It seems like there are many, many other unenjoyable tasks one could devote time to that would actually be productive. |
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Ryu_Hirakashi
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Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Location: Middle River, MD |
| 14. Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 12:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Slowpoke wrote: | | Ryu_Hirakashi wrote: | Well from my experiences with IIDX it was never meant to be "fun". It's never been a word I would use to describe IIDX. Hence, why I could understand why you're average american gamer couldn't pick it up. People need to let go of that concept and they'll be a lot better off in the end when it comes to video gaming now-a-days.
Hirakashi Ryu |
... except 99% of the people out there play games because they want to have fun. That's pretty much why "games" were invented 20,000 years ago (or so)
Even if you divorce Beatmania from the "fun" aspect and merely look at it as a skill you wish to excel at, I'm not sure why someone would want to devote time to perfecting something they don't enjoy doing in the first place. It seems like there are many, many other unenjoyable tasks one could devote time to that would actually be productive. |
I think there is a difference between something being gratifying and something being fun. I remember when I first started playing DDR. I told myself that I would excel at this because it was something worth exceling at. Not once did I ever say that I wanted to have fun playing DDR.
It's certainly the proper japanese attitude to have. Hence, why the bemani series is more accepted in japan. Americans will never evolve as gamers because everything has to be fun. Danm Americans!!! 
Hirakashi Ryu
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| Quote: | | For a beginner, if learning how to play pop'n music is like a parent holding his / her child's hand while crossing a busty street, then learning to play IIDX is like being kicked out of a moving car in the middle of nowhere and having to scrape enough money for a taxi cab ride home. |
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Slowpoke
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Joined: 28 Oct 2003
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| 15. Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Ryu_Hirakashi wrote: | | Not once did I ever say that I wanted to have fun playing DDR. I told myself that I would excel at this because it was something worth exceling at. |
This is where you lose me. Why is stomping on arrows worth excelling at? Outside of an insignificant % of the people in this world, no one is going to respect you for it or even care that you can do it well. And before you continue with the ethnocentric remarks, I'd love to hear some other Japanese people say, "Of course we don't have fun playing DDR!" Personally, I think your viewpoint is the aberration. |
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Ryu_Hirakashi
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Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Location: Middle River, MD |
| 16. Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Slowpoke wrote: | | Ryu_Hirakashi wrote: | | Not once did I ever say that I wanted to have fun playing DDR. I told myself that I would excel at this because it was something worth exceling at. |
This is where you lose me. Why is stomping on arrows worth excelling at? Outside of an insignificant % of the people in this world, no one is going to respect you for it or even care that you can do it well. And before you continue with the ethnocentric remarks, I'd love to hear some other Japanese people say, "Of course we don't have fun playing DDR!" Personally, I think your viewpoint is the aberration. |
Well my friend the reply for this statement is......"That actions speak louder than words." You really have to look at the demographic that plays DDR and IIDX. I mean sure people aren't going to come out and agree with me, but when it comes fight time. Look at the expression in their eyes.
As I have always known; the japanese are quite serious when they set their minds to things. No matter how hard it may be they always fight to the end. They are taught to put everything into what they do. That's why they can excel at stuff like this. That's just a cultural difference.
I don't give a Rat's @ss if people care or admire what I do. Like everything else in this world; something only has value when man puts value into it.
Hirakashi Ryu
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| Quote: | | For a beginner, if learning how to play pop'n music is like a parent holding his / her child's hand while crossing a busty street, then learning to play IIDX is like being kicked out of a moving car in the middle of nowhere and having to scrape enough money for a taxi cab ride home. |
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[ES] GARYsurvivor
Trick Member
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Joined: 12 Oct 2004
Location: Lakewood, CO |
| 17. Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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I personally play for improvement of my skill more than just for fun. Sure it's fun, but I want to be great at this because it's the only thing I'm good at, besides being a loner nerd.  |
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eyebrowsoffire
Trick Member
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Location: Santa Barbara, CA |
| 18. Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 5:30 pm Post subject: |
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My dream in life now is to own an arcade with all sorts of Bemani games so that an entire community could enjoy it. I wouldn't really do it for a profit, I would do it for the love of the games. I would KILL to have some Bemani games besides DDR accesible to me. It would be great to be the owner of an arcade that is supplying everyone with rare machines in good condition! Ahh... maybe someday...
EDIT: BTW, (didn't want to double post) I think everyone on this forum should take lessons from Ryu_Hirakashi and Slowpoke on discussing things in forums. This is the way to post, people, not mindlessly exchanging posts of "OMG UR cigarette!!!" Alright, I'm done.
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~Reign~
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Joined: 16 May 2002
Location: Berkeley, CA |
| 19. Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Ryu_Hirakashi wrote: | | Well from my experiences with IIDX it was never meant to be "fun". It's never been a word I would use to describe IIDX. |
Ok, I don't get this. You don't think IIDX is fun, or you don't think it was meant to be fun? What kind of shit is that? I play IIDX. I play it a helluva lot more than DDR. Why? Because it's fun! I think it's more fun than DDR. Sure, it takes quite some skill to get better, but that's half the fun right there: trying to get better. You call yourself a gamer, and you make a remark like that? Even if you don't call yourself a gamer, that's just a retarded thing to say. Period. If IIDX wasn't meant to be fun, why is it that people play IIDX more than DDR nowadays?
| Quote: | | As I have always known; the japanese are quite serious when they set their minds to things. No matter how hard it may be they always fight to the end. They are taught to put everything into what they do. That's why they can excel at stuff like this. That's just a cultural difference. |
That is NOT true. ANYONE can do ANYTHING if they put their mind to it. The japanese are just more persistant than any other race at whatever they do. If you wanna be japanese so bad, move to Japan and send me a postcard or somen.
| Quote: | | I remember when I first started playing DDR. I told myself that I would excel at this because it was something worth exceling at. Not once did I ever say that I wanted to have fun playing DDR. |
So let me get this straight: you don't play DDR to have fun? You play to excel at it? Ok, that is...interesting. So you spend all this money playing a game you don't have fun with? Do you even LIKE DDR? You want to make a career out of it or something? I don't know if anyone told you, but DDR is dying...Fast. Not to many people play DDR in Japan from what I hear. They mostly play IIDX or fighting games. So what you gonna do once DDR is dead?
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